PS5 and next Xbox launch speculation - Post E3 2018

When will the first 'next gen' console arrive?

  • H2 2019

    Votes: 438 14.0%
  • H1 2020

    Votes: 414 13.3%
  • H2 2020

    Votes: 2,025 64.9%
  • H1 2021

    Votes: 99 3.2%
  • H2 2021

    Votes: 144 4.6%

  • Total voters
    3,120
Yeah, that's very likely. Sony will be pushing the PS5 and they won't be supporting the PS4 with new exclusives. The next Uncharted almost certainly won't be on PS4. Same with the next God of War, the next Gran Turismo and others.
I can’t relate because I keep all my PlayStation consoles. I have them all since the original PlayStation. So I personally consider them great long term investments. I’m a bit of a collector though, so it’s different.

For you though, you could totally trade in/sell the PS4 Pro and recoup some of the cost once PS5 comes round. Pretty obvious, but worth mentioning. Haha. Or just wait for PS5, you’ll likely get 5 years out of it then. I guess you’re in 2019 camp so!
 
I can’t relate because I keep all my PlayStation consoles. I have them all since the original PlayStation. So I personally consider them great long term investments. I’m a bit of a collector though, so it’s different.

For you though, you could totally trade in/sell the PS4 Pro and recoup some of the cost once PS5 comes round. Pretty obvious, but worth mentioning. Haha. Or just wait for PS5, you’ll likely get 5 years out of it then. I guess you’re in 2019 camp so!
I'm also in team2019 unless Matt says otherwise.

It's very obvious now with two lowkey years. They are certainly gearing up for PS5.

Delayed a year didn't help PS4 reveal for the better. Quantic Dream is not even working on a current gen game like they did with Beyond Two Souls (yet still appeared at PS Meeting) so they are ready to go for PS Meeting early next year.

X86 to X86 would be easier to move recent unannounced PS4 projects to PS5. PS3 had a alien architecture so that definitely delayed The Last Guardian.
 
here is a question, assuming the scarlet stuff was right, and 1 version is a streaming box, do they release a app for current xb1s/x's to do streaming? it would make sure there was a solid instal base from day 1.
I think 2019 becomes way more likely if they do that.
 
But some of the other dudes know what they've talking about, which you clearly don't



We can safely assume It will be a next gen title though. There's been rumours (confirmed by Matt) of a troubled development and they probably want to launch next gen with a new Halo, same way Nintendo launched with a new Zelda.
Relax I am just giving my opinion. Lol
 
Even the dust being kicked up the warthog seemed beginning of gen to me. It nearly looked like a flat texture to me rather than volumetric particles.
I agree with you. But I just thought it was a cgi teaser. Something knocked up quickly prior to E3 in the absence of actually having anything meaningful to show. If the game actually looks like what was shown then it'll be incredibly underwhelming.
 
Hey #team2019:
What is your main requirement you want to be fulfilled by PS5/Nextbox that cannot wait until 2020 or cannot be fulfilled with the current consoles other than 60fps?
Please do share the obvious benefits of releasing console at 2020 instead of 2019?
Zen already arrived at 2017 and Navi seems to be a 2019 release. RAM manufacturers sounds like they want to increase price instead of reducing. 7nm AMD products are planned for release this year.
 
It's not a good long term investment.
You can say that for every piece of hardware.



Please do share the obvious benefits of releasing console at 2020 instead of 2019?
Zen already arrived at 2017 and Navi seems to be a 2019 release. RAM manufacturers sounds like they want to increase price instead of reducing. 7nm AMD products are planned for release this year.
Same can be said for you 2019 people. What are the benefits of a 2019 console? I dont see any. And the price will be an interesting one, because a 2019 console would mean a lukewarm uprade over an XboxOneX and probably as expensive as the OneX.
 
Same can be said for you 2019 people. What are the benefits of a 2019 console? I dont see any. And the price will be an interesting one, because a 2019 console would mean a lukewarm uprade over an XboxOneX and probably as expensive as the OneX.
The hardware is already there. Games? XBox/PS4 games fine-tuning will do wonders, just like XBox X and Pro patches.
 
Nothing.
But you are speaking as a consumer. Sony and Microsoft makes money from SOFTWARE sales, not hardware. So it is crazy for them to sell you PS5 a year early, when they are better off waiting a year and have a better marketing push getting the games that would actually earn them money.

Basically what you want has no benefits for Sony/MS. It is the games that both earns the money and sells the marketing. You might be willing to buy the machine early, but there is no benefit on the platform holder's end.
You are somewhat arbitrarily defining 2019 as 'early', which is ultimately a judgement that Sony will make. Planned launch was (from Matt) 2019, so technically 2020 is 'late', but that may have changed now, sure.

Clearly the software needs to be ready, but while some software may not be ready, that may not delay launch (eg. inFamous: SS on PS4 was 'late'; if Killzone: SF wasn't ready would that have delayed launch? I doubt it either honestly - what do you say to your third-party partners when they can't sell their games at the holidays?). The hardware being ready is ultimately the decider on launch timing and that could still decide between 2019 or 2020.

Also, not to forget the already announced Project Awakening by Cygames.

They've said it's a PS4 game, but I think when it releases, it will straddle the line and also be considered a PS5 game, much like Cyberpunk 2077, and Beyond Good & Evil 2.
Decisions between cross-gen BC/cross-gen Pro-style boosted games notwithstanding, I expect most games being announced now to 'straddle the line', although if BC is in it's a given they will be on PS5 regardless so it's hard to judge what that will mean in reality.

here is a question, assuming the scarlet stuff was right, and 1 version is a streaming box, do they release a app for current xb1s/x's to do streaming? it would make sure there was a solid instal base from day 1.
I think 2019 becomes way more likely if they do that.
Quite possibly, but that might well limit sales of any new hardware. From MS' POV it might not even matter to them. Maybe only the hardcore who want to get the most reliable experience will buy new hardware at all.
 
I want a PS5 in 2019.

PS4 pro is not a long term investment that I'm willing to make, but I want my Sony exclusives (TLOU2 in particular) to look as good as possible. I would also like a new controller, or at least some changes made with the Dual Shock 5. Honestly I'm just tired of this generation and want to move on.
Thank you for actually answer my question. I was really interested in some reasons besides the elephant in the room (CPU) that make it more favorable to have a new console earlier than later. From a non Pro owner perspective I totally can see the reasoning here. As an midcycle console owner I always forget that.

On a side note:
I didn’t expect the type of responses my question actually got from some other members. As it was any offensive statement or insult. Wow.
 
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Nothing.
But you are speaking as a consumer. Sony and Microsoft makes money from SOFTWARE sales, not hardware. So it is crazy for them to sell you PS5 a year early, when they are better off waiting a year and have a better marketing push getting the games that would actually earn them money.

Basically what you want has no benefits for Sony/MS. It is the games that both earns the money and sells the marketing. You might be willing to buy the machine early, but there is no benefit on the platform holder's end.
Jeeze, you're no craic.

I think Sony want as smooth a transition as possible to next gen. They have an eye on their PS+ subs just as much as the software sales. I think there's a more compelling argument that 2019 would facilitate a better transition.

(or equal at least, not this no chance attitude)
 
Creating cross-gen games was costly this gen. But devs are already tooled up to target different SKUs with the Pro/X, I'd expect the costs associated to be essentially the same. No way third parties are creating AAA next-gen exclusives with very limited pool of buyers when they can give their safe-bet regular IPs next-gen bells & whistles and please everybody.
 
Creating cross-gen games was costly this gen. But devs are already tooled up to target different SKUs with the Pro/X, I'd expect the costs associated to be essentially the same. No way third parties are creating AAA next-gen exclusives with very limited pool of buyers when they can give their safe-bet regular IPs next-gen bells & whistles and please everybody.
Ms exclusives have the reaching of console + PCs .....very different from the reaching of a new game exclusive just for the ps5
 
People are saying by 2020 the software would be ready and 2019 would be too early and it wouldn't make business sense to launch next year, considering the next gen consoles are most probably backwards compatible with the current ones do they expect a ton of games to be exclusive to next gen? if so, does abandoning the current consoles from the get go make a lot of business sense?
 
People are saying by 2020 the software would be ready and 2019 would be too early and it wouldn't make business sense to launch next year, considering the next gen consoles are most probably backwards compatible with the current ones do they expect a ton of games to be exclusive to next gen? if so, does abandoning the current consoles from the get go make a lot of business sense?
You didn't specify 1st party or 3rd party. By mixing the two, your paragraph literally doesn't make sense.

It makes business sense for 3rd parties to stick with PS4 for at least the first year of PS5's debut, and just have Pro/1X upgrades.

it makes business sense for 1st parties to go full PS5 exclusive, because it is their number 1 job to increase adoption rate of the new hardware.

Combine these two sentences, it makes business sense for Sony to make sure PS5 has the best 1st Party PS5 Exclusive lineup that they can make on release, because they can't count on 3rd parties. And to make sure the console has the best game line-up, delaying the console release until the games are ready makes business sense.
 
You didn't specify 1st party or 3rd party. By mixing the two, your paragraph literally doesn't make sense.

It makes business sense for 3rd parties to stick with PS4 for at least the first year of PS5's debut, and just have Pro/1X upgrades.

it makes business sense for 1st parties to go full PS5 exclusive, because it is their number 1 job to increase adoption rate of the new hardware.

Combine these two sentences, it makes business sense for Sony to make sure PS5 has the best 1st Party PS5 Exclusive lineup that they can make on release, because they can't count on 3rd parties. And to make sure the console has the best game line-up, delaying the console release until the games are ready makes business sense.
How many PS5 exclusives do you expect at launch?
 
How many PS5 exclusives do you expect at launch?
Nintendo style, multiple exclusives spread out over a whole year. But at least one AAA if not two on release.

BC is what changed the equation. Sony really needed to make PS5 exclusives because it is unlikely anyone else would. It is a side effect that most haven't really considered.

Remember, even though 1X has BC with 360, it was not true 100% BC and had to be spread out over time. Sure, Nintendo did it for decades and so did PS1 -> PS2. But back then we had several magnitude greater improvements in game graphics and gameplay every generation, people WANT to upgrade. But now, the leaps are not so great anymore.
 
I expect one or two larger games and a few smaller Resogun style titles, regardless of whether the console releases in 19 or 20.

The larger games might not even be first party, PS4 launch was the exception in that regard.
Which studios would be making the big games though, Guerilla got done with Horizon DLC in late 2017 and I don't think 3 years is enough for a next gen RPG at launch.
 
People are saying by 2020 the software would be ready and 2019 would be too early and it wouldn't make business sense to launch next year, considering the next gen consoles are most probably backwards compatible with the current ones do they expect a ton of games to be exclusive to next gen? if so, does abandoning the current consoles from the get go make a lot of business sense?
I think I mostly disagree with the notion about next-gen "needing" multiple games at/around launch or year 1 because not only is that not good business sense (small base to sell many big budget games to=most lose money) it would also then mean waiting 3-6 years for most of those studios' next games (all at once again). A staggered and controlled release of games is a much better idea and if BC is in (a subject I have been skeptical about) then this can also only help.

Even the big third-parties will partner up with Sony/MS to make sure their $50-$100 million+ games gets a nice release slot so as to minimize risk I would have thought?
 
I think I mostly disagree with the notion about next-gen "needing" multiple games at/around launch or year 1 because not only is that not good business sense (small base to sell many big budget games to=most lose money
First Parties will throw away as many sales opportunities as they can if it means they can improve hardware adoption. Growing the base is their job, more than even game sales. if anything, the game sales is the side effect of them growing the console base, their true duty. The same way Nintendo get people to buy the Switch.
 
Bloodborne shifted over 2 million copies. It may not get a sequel, but I’ll be surprised if we don’t get a full-fledged exclusive AAA title out of FROM in the first two years.

We also know Ueda is at work on his next title and doing things “that weren’t possible before.”
Yeah, I feel the dame way. Hopefully it's BB2, but if not we could get a different exclusive type deal. And yes, a Ueda game is also coming for next ge, we just don't know exactly when.

Also, not to forget the already announced Project Awakening by Cygames.

They've said it's a PS4 game, but I think when it releases, it will straddle the line and also be considered a PS5 game, much like Cyberpunk 2077, and Beyond Good & Evil 2.
Ah thanks, I totally forgot about this game. They probably want to release it at least for the PS4 and take advantage of the install base, but it definitely falls into the category of games that will release close to the PS5 launch and hence receive similar treatment as TLoU2 and DS, be that BC, a next gen patch, or whatever the solution for those Cross-Gen titles Somy implements
 
First Parties will throw away as many sales opportunities as they can if it means they can improve hardware adoption. Growing the base is their job, more than even game sales. if anything, the game sales is the side effect of them growing the console base, their true duty. The same way Nintendo get people to buy the Switch.
Not sure I would agree but take Sony, they still have 5? single game studios to release exclusive games in the next 5-18 months and then it will be 3/4 years or more before we see a game from them again if they don't do cross-gen.

I just can't see any release timing (2019 or 2020) working without using cross-gen? Multiple exclusives/first party games in year one and then multiple others over the following years just isn't feasible to me.
 
Not sure I would agree but take Sony, they still have 5? single game studios to release exclusive games in the next 5-18 months and then it will be 3/4 years or more before we see a game from them again if they don't do cross-gen.

I just can't see any release timing (2019 or 2020) working without using cross-gen? Multiple exclusives/first party games in year one and then multiple others over the following years just isn't feasible to me.
Well here is the thing; why do you think Sony had gone completely silent on their first party studios? And they are doing so in such an obvious fashion. And it is clearly not true that they don't have any spare studios, because if that was the case then why would anyone even complain about a lack of new game announcements?
 
This is the thing lot of people ignore or are not enough aware of.There is nothing more important to Sony then to keep those ~35 million PS+ subscribers in the next gen,locked into PS ecosystem.
exactly.
I don't understand how people thinks
Sony will keep releasing just 2 free PS4
games for PS+ for 15 months from March 2019 to Nov 2020.
 
Well here is the thing; why do you think Sony had gone completely silent on their first party studios? And they are doing so in such an obvious fashion. And it is clearly not true that they don't have any spare studios, because if that was the case then why would anyone even complain about a lack of new game announcements?
Sorry mate, I'm not sure what you are saying here? Are you saying Sony may have multiple secret games in development?
 
Releasing in 2019 rather than 2020 benefits include an entire additional year of sales, possibly getting one year ahead of the competition, allowing the release of an upgraded mid gen system a full year earlier (if that is still the plan) and at least for Sony it also allows them to have the power crown back for some time.

The benefits of 2020 are minimal in comparison. There is nothing available in 2020 that won’t be available by holiday 2019.

You guys arguing AAA games are blowing your horn, cause we have no idea what’s coming after holiday 2019 at this point.
 
Sorry mate, I'm not sure what you are saying here? Are you saying Sony may have multiple secret games in development?
I am saying for the last several months now, ERA had made note of the fact that Sony stopped announcing new games. But how could all of the Sony studios be busy, if ERA is expecting new games to be announced?

And it isn't that Sony is being secretive, but that they can't announce PS5 exclusive games until they actually announce PS5 itself.
 
I think the folks drawing clear battle lines in the sand over speculative next-gen console release dates need to calm the hell down.

Poeople in this thread are becoming far too hostile over what effectively amounts to, "my guess is superior to your guess".

There are no facts, barely any meaningful rumours and therefore no real reason for people to be standing and vehemently defending a position of when next-gen "must" launch.

Pretty much every justification for a 2019 launch could be relayed to a 2020 launch also. There's no reason to not sit on the fence and wait for more info, instead drawing lines in the sand.

The "#team2019/2020" rhetoric really needs to stop, as peeps clearly can't seem to understand that it was originally intended as a bit of fun, but now folks are turning needlessley hostile over it.
 
I am saying for the last several months now, ERA had made note of the fact that Sony stopped announcing new games. But how could all of the Sony studios be busy, if ERA is expecting new games to be announced?

And it isn't that Sony is being secretive, but that they can't announce PS5 exclusive games until they actually announce PS5 itself.
Right, got it. From my own memory (others no doubt know better here) Sony love to announce games at least 3 E3 showings from release. More importantly I think we know Sony have the new San Diego studio, GG working on HZ2 for the last almost 2 years plus soon to start their 2nd team game, ND in pre-production on their post-TLoU2 game etc. The point is that if any of these studios were working on another PS4 game then Sony would have announced them at last E3. Ergo all big AAA games are now PS5.

Maybe someone else can explain it better.
 
Releasing in 2019 rather than 2020 benefits include an entire additional year of sales, possibly getting one year ahead of the competition, allowing the release of an upgraded mid gen system a full year earlier (if that is still the plan) and at least for Sony it also allows them to have the power crown back for some time.

The benefits of 2020 are minimal in comparison. There is nothing available in 2020 that won’t be available by holiday 2019.

You guys arguing AAA games are blowing your horn, cause we have no idea what’s coming after holiday 2019 at this point.
Yes there is. 7nm+ (cheaper) APU and cheaper GDDR6 ram.
 
Lots of talk about software, but from a hardware point of view, isn't there anything that becomes available in 2020 only or a more high-end solution becomes cheaper (kinda like 16 × 0.5 GB GDDR5 in the PS4) and as such could be an option?

Fake edit: Andromeda already answered, before I asked.
 
I've just read the last page, mind you, but I know there's starting to be a lot of discussion in the PC gaming arena about the effect of tariffs with China and North America.

I haven't seen any discussion on this last page about how this will undoubtedly effect next gen. Personally, I'd imagine Sony and MS want to stick to roughly $399 again. The question is if these tarrifs caught them with their pants down or if they expected them in time and are using cheaper components in order to keep the price at a level they can sell.

If I've missed this discussion, my apologies, but if it hasn't been broached yet I'd love your thoughts.


The past few years I've been a PC gamer, but it's really seeming to be becoming a little rich for my blood what with the new GPUs being effected by tarrifs.
 
I think the folks drawing clear battle lines in the sand over speculative next-gen console release dates need to calm the hell down.

Poeople in this thread are becoming far too hostile over what effectively amounts to, "my guess is superior to your guess".

There are no facts, barely any meaningful rumours and therefore no real reason for people to be standing and vehemently defending a position of when next-gen "must" launch.

Pretty much every justification for a 2019 launch could be relayed to a 2020 launch also. There's no reason to not sit on the fence and wait for more info, instead drawing lines in the sand.

The "#team2019/2020" rhetoric really needs to stop, as peeps clearly can't seem to understand that it was originally intended as a bit of fun, but now folks are turning needlessley hostile over it.
I think you are being overdramatic.

People on the 2019 camp understand that it's just a possibility, not a reality, and they're (we are) perfectly aware it may as well be 2020.

In my case I prefer 2019 but today I'd say its 60/40 for 2020 if we ignore the bloomberg reporter tweet, and the other way around if we give validity to it.

I'd say the only people that are being unreasonable are those that say 2019 has 0% chance, or that it will release in 2021/22. Granted, most of those people are in the other thread, not this one.

Overall I'd say those that are/seem frustrated is due to the lack of a definitive answer
 
Imagine 14tf raw power, 32gb gddr6 and zen 2 8 core/16 threads at 3ghz announcing in PS Meeting next year. what a meltdown.
Zen 2 sounds like Mark Cerny went with instead of Navi.

Didn't Ubisoft's CEO (Yves) warned MS and Sony about another long generation and it shouldn't extend 6 years unless one platform holder is releasing a next gen console after 6 years and the other platform holder goes for 7 years due to more power?

https://www.gamesindustry.biz/artic...ve-been-penalised-by-the-lack-of-new-consoles
 
Considering the output from Sony FP recently, and what looks like longer development times across the board for AAA, I doubt the extra year (max) a 2020 launch would have over 2019 would make any significant difference in FP launch titles.

Horizon 2 I fully expect to be shown at the reveal, but only released within a year of launch (2019 OR 2020). Maybe if 2020 is true then it might appear at launch, but even then I think it would come later.

I envisage Sony perhaps trailing new FP titles at reveal, but probably launching with a few partner titles/one or two new non-AAA FP games max (excluding currently known FP). I think they can get away with that initially, as long as they can show the promise is there for the future. Horizon 2 might well be a big part of that (as Horizon was for PS4 and Pro, incidentally).

This situation doesn't necessarily change much between 2019 or 2020 launches either. Sure, 2020 might allow one or two more FP games to be shown/delivered, but I doubt it's significant enough to be worth delaying a hardware launch for, all else being equal. PS5 FP will be thin on the ground until 2021 I'd wager.
 
Considering the output from Sony FP recently, and what looks like longer development times across the board for AAA, I doubt the extra year (max) a 2020 launch would have over 2019 would make any significant difference in FP launch titles.

Horizon 2 I fully expect to be shown at the reveal, but only released within a year of launch (2019 OR 2020). Maybe if 2020 is true then it might appear at launch, but even then I think it would come later.

I envisage Sony perhaps trailing new FP titles at reveal, but probably launching with a few partner titles/one or two new non-AAA FP games max (excluding currently known FP). I think they can get away with that initially, as long as they can show the promise is there for the future. Horizon 2 might well be a big part of that (as Horizon was for PS4 and Pro, incidentally).

This situation doesn't necessarily change much between 2019 or 2020 launches either. Sure, 2020 might allow one or two more FP games to be shown/delivered, but I doubt it's significant enough to be worth delaying a hardware launch for, all else being equal. PS5 FP will be thin on the ground until 2021 I'd wager.
It can't be worse than PS4 reveal. People needs to remember how boring it was except Mark Cerny's part.

Driveclub who has been in concept since 10 years back and they waited for PS4 gen to realize the concept with the next technology.
 
This situation doesn't necessarily change much between 2019 or 2020 launches either. Sure, 2020 might allow one or two more FP games to be shown/delivered, but I doubt it's significant enough to be worth delaying a hardware launch for, all else being equal. PS5 FP will be thin on the ground until 2021 I'd wager.
That's my take as well.

Every big Sony Studio is hard at work on PS4 games. Only Studio Japan, Polyphony Digital and Guerrilla Games are "free" to develop a PS5 Game for 2019/2020 and Polyphony Digital is slow as hell so we're "stuck" with Studio Japan and Guerilla Games.

I'm on Team 2019 still and think we'll get a Studio Japan Launch Title and a Launch WIndow Game from Guerrilla Games (Horizon 2 imo). 2019/2020 we'll get a Games from Bluepoint, From Software and others like them.

2021 the next round of Spiderman, God of War, new Quantic Dream Game, Naughty Dog Game, etc. will start.

But 2019/2020 will be slim pickings on the first party front.
 
Lots of talk about software, but from a hardware point of view, isn't there anything that becomes available in 2020 only or a more high-end solution becomes cheaper (kinda like 16 × 0.5 GB GDDR5 in the PS4) and as such could be an option?

Fake edit: Andromeda already answered, before I asked.
No new solution per se, just that the solution they will use will get cheaper.

Yes there is. 7nm+ (cheaper) APU and cheaper GDDR6 ram.
Can we estimate how much cheaper? Could this extra cost be absorbed by Sony?

I expect them to subsidize the PS5 by around $50-100.
 
I think it will have the basic HDR/latest mainstream HDMI/Audio support but that is all. After Pro not having 4K Blu-ray when if anyone suggested it wouldn't was branded a heretic! No, PS5 will be a pure gaming machine outside the standard/basic video/audio support of the time. No real need to complicate it or add any more costs than necessary IMO.
It does seem that Sony who helped create UHD Blu-ray is not interested in it Or Sony is interested in supporting UHD 8K glassless 3D for their 2020 8K TVs and UHD audio for their high end stereos and ceded 4K to the Korean and Chinese manufacturers. No current 4K TV or UHD Blu-ray player can support 8K/4k 3D while a PS5 with HDMI 2.1 and AMD's VM security can support UHD 2K/4K/8K and 3D. I believe Sony will be releasing UHD Blu-ray 3D before or slightly after CES 2020.

VR and UHD 3D for 8K 3D TVs is synergistic.
VR has commercial 3D media coming which will also be targeted to UHD 3D TVs.
 
Releasing in 2019 rather than 2020 benefits include an entire additional year of sales, possibly getting one year ahead of the competition, allowing the release of an upgraded mid gen system a full year earlier (if that is still the plan) and at least for Sony it also allows them to have the power crown back for some time.

The benefits of 2020 are minimal in comparison. There is nothing available in 2020 that won’t be available by holiday 2019.

You guys arguing AAA games are blowing your horn, cause we have no idea what’s coming after holiday 2019 at this point.
But why buy a new console when you can play all 2019 games on your PS4 or XboxOneX (for the best multiplat console version if you want that)

So far i havent seen any good reason for a rushed 2019 console release.
 
But why buy a new console when you can play all 2019 games on your PS4 or XboxOneX (for the best multiplat console version if you want that)

So far i havent seen any good reason for a rushed 2019 console release.
Why buy an X if you can play all the games in an S?

Why upgrade to a Pro?

Plus is would not be a rushed release. It was the date they've been planning for.
 
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